Captain Bill's Blog

That's too funny! Can't help but laugh, but I hope you get your stuff back!

Thanks Dave. I won't get it back, but I learned a lesson.

Bill I've had the same thing happen to me.  In my case it was a couch and coffee table placed in the LR. We were planning an open house in two day and needed to have a place to sit.  Brand new I should add from a former model home.  No one would admit to who the crew was and we had to eat the loss.  Of course now I don't stage any vacant property unless I know it is 100% secure.

Sad commentary on the businesses the banks hire to maintain the properties.  It reminds me of the rings of thieves that prowl new construction sites and steal new appliances.  Sad.

Val,

That is right out theft and I'm sorry to hear you won't get your things back. With agents like you going the extra mile to make their listings show to their fullest potential it's a shame! Buyers and other agents  wonder why listings aren't staged better, now they know!!

Bill, it so true that you learn something new every day in this business...sometimes it is an expensive lesson. I am so sorry about your staging items. I always say "What goes around comes around" and whoever took your things will get paid back some day.

Cindy, I am sorry someone took your couch and coffee table too. For some, it is desperate times.

Bill, sorry to hear you won't get your things back. This was an expensive lesson.

We recently had an issue where a condo owner had his house entered by a foreclosure clean up crew from a big American bank and they started emptying out the house. The owner came to see them destroying his possessions only to find out that it supposed to be the condo next door.

That had to be aggravating.  I had a loss once when the homeowners moved out of state and their relatives came in and packed up my stuff and removed it.  It was upsetting on two levels, I loved the stuff and I had to go out and replace it.

No respect!  When a house is under contract, I pull my lockbox so that the appraiser or anyone else has to go through me to get into the property.  NO ONE goes in without contacting me first.  I like your approach!

Bill,

Terrible events. You're right about not pushing the AM too hard though. Chalk it up to that expensive lesson...life.

Rich

Talk about tacky...yicks ! You think that someone would feel some guilt there and do some sort of reimbursement...oh wait..guilt....lender...nyaaaaah

Bank Preservation Crew Perks... It's so annoying that we have to remove lockboxes on properties when they go into contract to protect what's inside.

It speaks to the mentality of the people. They don't care because they think they are dealing with "deadbeats." I have had my lockboxes clipped and signs thrown out instead of a simple phone call (my sign is there, after all). 

Yuck! So sorry to hear this.

We have had the same thing happen to us too. The most common thing we see is with short sales that are vacated. The preservation team, er um team of thieves comes in changes the locks, steals our signs and our lock boxes. I think we have lost a total of about 7 signs and 8 or 9 lock boxes now. I no longer use electronic lock boxes due to the cost. Its a despicalbe part of our business. In all cases the banks never gave us the info on the preservation company, and we just chalked it up to the cost of doing business. Its definately a pain in the you know what.

Try sending an invoice to the asset manager and giving them the option of paying it by deducting it from what they pay the property preservation company.

Cindy: Sorry you had the same experience.

Lenn;  I'm honored that you stopped by. I don't think these guys would be actually theives who would go and burglarize places. I believe it's simply opportunistic by clean up crews, who think anything of value in a house they clean up is theirs to keep.

Dorie: If I do any more REO's I'll still do some minor staging if it will help, but I the crews won't be able to get in without calling me first.

Diane: Sometimes a lesson learned can prevent a more expensive incident from happening later on.

Michael: Thanks, but the important thing is to learn something from each bad experience

W Darrell: They must have broken into the door of that unit, otherwise they couldn't get it. That would be quite a surprise for the owner

Geri:   I guess in your case it was an honest error, but you still had a loss

Bob:  You're doing it the right way

Richard:  We learn from our experiences. Learn from the bad ones so we can create more good ones.

Sally & David: I know the bank was feeling very sorry for my loss. They probably couldn't sleep an night

Paul:  That's the way they look at it. Perks

I really really don't want to go here...I had the same thing happen but it was all metal items that the crew was going to sell.  We called in the Elkhart County Sheriff and the crew waved around some paperwork that the sheriff didn't understand so they let them take everything.  When I got there I called out the sheriff again and his sergent said I was causing trouble, they had the right to take the stuff they did (what????) even though  it was not yet in foreclosure! The property still is owned by the homeowner! Still is today! The sheritff came out again and I made him call the company owners at home, the owners were not happy and said everything went to the dump yet it was 7 pm.  Not likely. Then the owner called my broker and told her how unprofessional I am...oh yeah, the bank said they did not send them out...

If the insurance spam comment is still there it's because I've just reported it so AR management can deal with it. They're delete it when they take whatever action they deem necessary.

J. Phillip: They just blindly follow instructions - if they remember the instructions.

Jane:  Thanks, and I hope it will prevent others from having the same experience

Steve & Tina: The electronic lock boxes we use in Phoenix are pretty hefty. They would have to work pretty hard to get one off. Wow. Yes it is a pain

Tony and Suzanne: That's a good idea, and had I known this when it happened I would have probably done that. I'm glad you mentioned it because it'll give others reading the comments the information they canuse.

Evelyn: That's a terrible experience. The only thing a lender can do if they know the home is vacant (they call it abandoned) is to come out and change the locks.

Was the house already foreclosed or was it in pre-foreclosure. I have had my electronic lockboxes stolen and it drives me crazy. It's illegal. It's a crime.

Guess you gotta be really careful in this economy.

Good post for everyone.    We live we learn.    I have seen it happen too many times when a buyer viewed the home there were items they wanted or would like left in the home.   Then the "TRASH OUT TEAM" comes in and empties the home.   From what I have heard everything goes to the DUMP.  I think it would be nice if Non Profit Housing organizations had the opportunity to go in first to take things their clients might be able to use.  

Bill, this is so unjust, I don't even know what to say. I feel very sorry that great agents like you have to deal with theft and, even worse, a flat out lie... 

Thank you for sharing this story, I never even imagined that a bank, a lender, a "preservation crew" can act in such way. 

Captain Bill

Good and timely data for our industry. I had a similar episode and was lucky enough to be there on two occasions when the preservation crew popped in. First time had to do with gardening issues and the second with furniture left behind that the new buyer bought. If I wasn't there, it could have been turned into a post like yours........thank you & best

Richard:  It was an REO.

Walter:  Exactly right

Robert:  I would tell them that I had their code on there and somebody must have screwed with it. If they asked. It's only the preservaton people that would be concerned. The appraisers and bpo guys would call me first anyway and I have an electonic box for them.

Tim:  Everything goes to the dump that the preservation team can't use themselves.

Anna: That's life in the foreclosure world and we have to live and learn

Richie: I'm glad it turned out better in your case.

Bill

Bill, that is exactly what I would do... use my own code.  In a case like this where the agent loses all their staging materials, I would rather use my own code, and apologize for it later if they ever complained, rather than take the chance, and lose my staging materials again. 

The Asset manager could have easily gotten your stuff back with a phone call but they don't want to be bothered. They want the cheapest help they can find, including real estate agents. It's not worth the aggravation considering the time and expense anymore for me. I used to do a lot of REO and anymore I leave it to the newbies as I've got better things to do.

BTW - changing the code may or may not work since a lot of the companies will from time to time audit their listings and if you're box doesn't have the code they require they'll insist you change it or threaten to pull the listing. I even had a big argument with one AM over putting a sentrilock box on the property. I finally had to agree to put their box on the back door (but didn't publish the code) and the sentrilock box on the front door.

It's so frustrating when you try to do right by your client - the bank - and are thrwarted by this kind of activity.  Sorry for the loss;  hope you get some comfort in knowing you've made someone else's house much prettier!

Bill, there is nothing funny about what they did and why the Asset Manager would not take care of it for you.  It is unfortunate that this happens and I agree with your solution to use your own code.  Sorry this happened to you.  ~ Susan

Tough lesson learned for you there with the 'vultures'.  That's what I call them & as you say no clean out was necessary but I bet they billed for it plenty.  In fact, just what you said, I did not put their coded lockbox on the property this last time so I HAVE control of who goes in & out.  There was one company just by my house that spent 4 hours in a property doing ??? I'm not sure.  I bet if you talked with the neighbors they would have seen a large truck there & your stuff being place in it. 

Of course they take every cotton picking thing, the asset manager should have told you when they were coming. Lesson learned.

Capt. Bill, you need some stager's insurance!  Of course, my deductible is $500.00 so, given the amount of your loss, it still wouldn't have been recouped.  Sorry for your loss.

Ooohh.. Patsy has a great idea with staging insurance. This is certainly a tough lesson to learn. Yes, change the code!

$500 lesson, at least it wasn't $5000.  Better luck next time and great advise for everyone here.  thanks for sharing.

Given the nasty condition of foreclosures around here, I don't begrudge the crews for taking things they can use.  BUT to go in a clean home that is obviously on the market and staged for sale and take that small number ofnew  items is theft, plain and simple.  So sorry this happened to you! 

Sorry to hear your property was stolen, Bill. I have heard stories of these crews stealing things from the homes, including swapping out the home's new appliances with old ones.

Boo! I'm sorry to have read this, Bill.  What probably burns you up a little more is knowing the quality of your items, someone else is surely using them.  Thank you for sharing so the rest of us can be a little more proactive.

Carolyn: Right, there are a couple ways to deal with it.

Walter: You're exactly right. I only took the REO's that I was offered. I never marketed heavily for them. Had I wanted to go that route I would have had to do a lot of marketing to the AM's and attend the 5 Star Conventions, and all the other methods of getting them, but I just wasn't keen on  the way they treated agents.

Susan: Right, we got the home sold pretty fast, so that was a comfort

Lyn: It was all small stuff, decorative dishes and decorative bath room stuff, flowers, vases, etc.

Missy:  The AM may have not even known they were coming. I believe all that is handled by a completed different department and I doubt they communicate with each other.

Patsy:  With the small amount $500 it would be too costly to have insurance

Vickie:  That's what I did

German: Of course I would never put $5,000 worth of staging in an REO, but if I had, then I would have pressed the bank very hard.

Michael: Great suggestions, thank you

Bill: I haven't heard about that, but I'm not surprised.

Lisa:  Right, and we had to take the time to go replace them. When we do regular staging for my rehabs we always hire a staging company. There are times when only a little staging in the bath rooms and kitchen are required and we do that ourselves.

I think this type of thing happens more often that we would like to think.  Investors are contracting out to loan servicers who contract out to national field service companies who contract out to local field service companies who are "merely following instructions" with nobody in the chain willing to take responsibility for the actions taken.

Hi Bill~  Nothing surprises me anymore in this business.  You know they knew they shouldn't have taken those things! 

We all learn from bad experiences...Next time we'll know better...

Have a great day!

David:  You hit the nail on the head

Vickie:  Of course they knew. Had the bank followed up, they would have said, well were hired to clean out the place and we did. Now everything is at the dump!!! And that would be half right.

Joshua: Life is full of experiences. We just have to learn from them

That is STUNNINGLY foul .. but I'm glad you've published your experience for the community to benefit from!!

Weird times, huh??

That is so frustrating and maddening Val, because I think we have all had a bad experience with a trash out company at one time or another. Nothing like your story where you tried to make the home more appealing by staging it and now all is lost, but close. Ugh! Banks!

I would never stage an REO unless instructed to do so by the AM.  Too many people going in and out on the code.

If you change the code on the lockbox there is a good chance the preservation company will cut off the box and rekey again so don't bother.

Bill, I am so sorry to hear that!

Is there any sort of contract that explains what the "clean out crew" is supposed to do? If there is any trace of paperwork you might be able to catch them.

Keep pressing on!

Val, Bummer!!! Hate to hear about your loss. Bummer #2 is that there is nothing you can do about it either. Congrats on the feature...

That's unfortunate, but it sounds like you've come up with a way to avoid this happening again.

I had something similar happen. We were close to closing. I let the new buyers store their new boxed blinds in the house. The property preservation people took them. OMG no common sense. For furnished resort condos I repeatedly email the property preservation company they are to leave the furnishings and cc the AM. It works.

Thank you for sharing so the rest of us are aware that these things DO happen.

This isn't very surprising.  Some preservation companies are notorious for billing the REO companies for work never done.  The listing agents also have fun getting repairs made by them too.

Mike: Right, and getting weirder

Terri:  We still got it sold, the house was very nice

James:  The AM's will never instruct anyone to stage. It's something extra that we were willing to do in that case. It was for our benefit to help get the house sold faster

Anna: They're just supposed to clean out everything in the house, do a quick vacuum and leave it broom clean. In this case it was a matter of "should have been honest and used common sense".

Michael:  It's not the end of the world, just a lesson learned. Thanks, and thanks to whoever Suggested

Julie:  Prepossession is always risky. Glad you have a system down that works now.

Erika: My pleasure, we all learn from our misakes

Rodney:  Probably so. I never had repairs done, but I did have to pay some local trash out people, and pool clean up companies. I don't think it's worth it to play games with the invoices, so I played it straight. It makes me sleep better at night.

That was my point.  You have no control over the property even though you are responsible for it.  It was a mistake to stage it.  Count it as a lesson learned.  Luckily it was only $500 worth.

Price sells not staging ... Good luck on the next one.

Interesting story. Guess you should wait a week or two to stage.

That's the same reason that I make my kids bring their toys in from the front yard. Sorry about your loss.

James:  I don't regret staging it, and I have counted it as a lesson learned. Next time I'll do things differently.

Robert:  I have to know if I'm going to hire the trash out, or if the bank is, then I'll know how to proceed.

Eric:  I'm not sure I agree with the analogy, but thanks.

Bill, it's sad these things happens but they do probably occur more often than we think.  I had a short sale once where the owners had left quite a few personal belongings.  One day I arrived at the property after the bank had sent out someone to cover the pool and found the front door wide open with items in the house missing.  Very sad.

Silvia:  Unfortunately people think things in a vacant house are theirs for the taking.

On a short sale of mine, the client left things in the house they couldn't take, and a neighbor was going to take them out in a few days.

When I went out to take photos after the clients moved, there was a lot of stuff on the kitchen counters. I placed them in the pantry so I could get photos. And so there wouldn't be all the clutter when the house is shown.

The next day the lady (not my client) called and immediately accused me of taking stuff from the house. Before even asking me what happened.

I explained that I had to take pictures and if she looks in the pantry she'll find everything that was on the counter.

She understood and apologized for jumping the gun.

Hey Bill, wow that is some story, even with high "professionals you think you are safe doing business, but just shows you need to be aware with everyone..to bad. for those who stole your items, what goes around comes around they shall get there's. sorry to hear this news but glad to hear you still sold the home :)

Nothing surprises me anymor. We try hard to make the best representation of our listings and so many people can get in with the contractors lockbox. At least with Supra we know who, when and how long agents are in the home. No records with contractor lockbox.

Carole and Laura: It didn't occur to me that this could happen, but now I know and will do things differently next time.

Jim:  Right, and i always use a Supra box in addition to the contractor box, and only the contractors get the code to that.

What an awful story!  These foreclosures usually need all the help they can get and all the AMs are doing is discouraging agents from doing the best for the properties.  I am sorry to hear that you had to pay for this lesson.

Kathryn:  It was a lesson well learned, and could save me down the road.

Tough lesson learned, that's for sure.  Being robbed is a dirty feeling and probably makes you less trusting of people.  I am glad you wrote this blog.  I tend to be on the naive side and assume people are all above board, reading this blog is the nice dose of reality I need to remember that some people are just plain bad!

Coral:  I would just call these people opportunistic.

Bill - Thank for sharing your $500.00 lesson with us. We have tons of staging materials we allow some of our clients to use when they only need a few items. It could be a painful lesson if we had to replace some of it...

Brent: I would think whoever borrowed the items would be responsible for the loss.

Oh my God I'm so sorry that happened to you!  I hate working for preservation companies.  I like to do everything myself because I know the very best people in my community who will do the work for the best value.  

Maya: Apparently the banks were sold on a national type organization for preservation. It probablly costs them more that having it done through the AM and listing agent

NOTE: Post #76 has been reported as spam and AR will remove it after they check it out.

Dang, what a shame - I'm so sorry. 

Juli thanks, but that's life.

Bill, Your post and the many comments are much appreciated. I learn something of value everytime I check in.

Thanks Wayne, glad it was of value to you

I recognize the predicament that you're in since you want to maintain a relationship with the asset manager and still want your stuff back.  Although it may be a tax deduction, it brings hard feelings and there are some things that may not be replaceable.  Best of luck to you.

Leolinda, everything was replaceable so I just chalked it up to a learning experience.